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Gurdjieff, George Ivanovitch
A Tribute to G. I. Gurdjieff
Writings on Mullah Nassr Eddin
Contact with God
Work and Life
The Meaning of Life
Meetings 1941 - 1944
Eight Meetings in Paris 1943, 1944, 1946

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Gurdjieff, George Ivanovitch
Gurdjieff brought to the West a psychology and cosmology of the development of man. He started 'helping people to develop' around 1912 in Russia and continued until his death in 1949 in France.

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Contact with God

G: I have already answered this question when someone asked the same thing. I said: if you do not have an ideal, if you do not believe in God, then your father, your mother, your teacher can serve for you as an ideal.

Q: I have an ideal, I have always been a Catholic. But I no longer see Jesus Christ in the same way.

G: In the beginning Catholicism was very good, but not latterly. They searched for midday at two o'clock; they diluted everything. In the beginning it was superior to the Orthodox religion and to all others.

Q: I cannot recapture the faith of my childhood.

G: That is not necessary. You have lost that possibility. You are no longer a child, you are big now. You should have logic and not search automatically. To have direct contact with God is impossible. Millions and millions of nonentities wish to have relations with Mr. God direct. This is impossible. But you can have a relation in this line. What you do here, for instance, has this changed your interior ideal - since you took part in our conversations? (Yes) Then perhaps you have confidence in the person who directs here? (Yes) Then he can serve as techer in the meantime.

Q: That does not satisfy me entirely. I want something else.

G: Then make a program. You do not know what you want. I wish you to understand that your nearest - father, mother, teacher - can serve as your ideal in place of God. The real God, forget him. As you are, you can never have relations with God. When you have grown, this could be, but you are one among millions of nonentities. Meantime, take as an ideal whoever is nearest and then you can pray to God, because this person has an ideal also, this ideal has in turn an ideal and so on, on to God. God is far, there are many stages before you reach him, do not think about Him. Your ideal will be your God. Later you can have another ideal.

Mme. de Salzmann: God is much too far away. You are too small to have direct contact with him. Only he who is immediately above you can be God for you. He is a God who in his turn has a God. It is a ladder, there is always something above. Each degree (rung) leads you to another rung and you get your answer by the same chain.

G: You cannot pray directly to God. You imagine so, but you waste your time. It is from there that psychopathy comes. Like a monk. He says directly "God". He manipulates like this (gestures) and sixty years later he perishes like a dog without ever having received anything. He wanted God directly. No one has seen Him, for the law of contacts is strict. This law exists everywhere. You will look for your God when you have felt yourself guided in the right direction, on a good road, for instance by Mme. de Salzmann. Then she will be your God. She is not God, but she will be your first stage; you can have contact with God through her; make all your prayers and good manifestations pass through her and that itself will make contact with the next stage. Then a third stage and finally it is possible that your prayer will reach the real God. Exactly like the telegraph; a message to a relative in the country near Lyons. First from Paris to Lyons; then to another town, then to the village, then to your reletive's house. By states and it takes some time.


It seems to me that GIG succeded in getting a message across. Now it is up to me to apply it.

Steven Marino, United States
added 2003-05-16

Interesting. So Gurdjieff himself had a living master. The first stage is De Salzmann, the second Gurdjieff, the must be Gurdjieff's master who is developped enough to be in direct contact with Truth.

Alvaro Polo, Spain
added 2005-12-01

comment to previous...

Is that what you think?

Jay Vrai,
added 2007-01-19

We need to give rather than seize to recieve.In order that we recieve one must give, give in the sense of working with what is more imediate to our need.The relationship to something higher than oneself may arise from this effort and maybe one can relate this incident to being closer to "God".

michael james, Brazil
added 2007-03-12

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